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Socoder -> Off Topic -> HS2 - Chugging Along

Posted : Tuesday, 11 February 2020, 12:19
Jayenkai

HS2 - Chugging Along


I just can't wrap my head around the cost of HS2.
I'm all for building a new network, god knows the current one is insanely old, but ..
Billions?
How is it ... Billions?

Can someone explain that to me?
It seems way too much for a railway network.

Also, 2040 seems unreasonable, too, especially with Billions thrown at it.

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Posted : Tuesday, 11 February 2020, 12:33
rockford
It's not just about the network, but the infrastucture (roads, overpasses, bridges, tunnels etc. etc.), the planning, the development, the cost for moving people and compulsary purchase of land. It's about developing/purchasing trains for the track etc. etc. etc. And back-handers. Can't forget them...

Things like this take masses of time (and money). You really underestimate the amount of work required.
Posted : Tuesday, 11 February 2020, 13:34
Jayenkai
Yeah, I'm also failing to understand why they aren't simply reusing the majority of the old abandoned railway paths that already meander through the country..

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Posted : Tuesday, 11 February 2020, 19:36
rockford
Are there that many abandoned railway paths? If so, it'd probably cost more to assess, repair and rebuild (for purpose) those than start from scratch - they may also not be in the right places or won't allow full speed. Dunno. It's also likely that the old track wouldn't be adequate for new trains.

BTW I personally don't see the need for HS2, but I also didn't (and still don't) see the need for the Chunnel. But that got built (despite similar levels of funding disdain (and under-estimaton), both here and in France), but it's fair to say its cost was probably worth it and saved a lot more in time and money since.

We'll find out in 2080. If we're still alive!
Posted : Tuesday, 11 February 2020, 20:01
Jayenkai
As far as I'm aware, and god knows I'm probably wrong, the old train paths, the land, and everything, are still owned by Network Rail.

All the youtube vids I've watched of urban explorers and the like, (Martin Zero, especially) have repeatedly made reference to the land still being owned by them.
Sure, the tracks are almost all gone, but for the mostpart there's a ton of routes just sitting there, unused, overgrown in the decades since.
Maybe they're just not suitable.. maybe they wind too much or something.
Or maybe they ARE using those paths, wherever possible.

My mind keeps going back to that figure, though.
That really does seem far too much.

I know the Chunnel was a long time ago, costs increase and all that, but that involved some fairly ingenious work to get done, and even that wasn't as much as HS2's costing... HS2 should be piss-easy by comparison..

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Posted : Tuesday, 11 February 2020, 20:40
rockford
To put HS2 into perspective:-

The cost of the channel tunnel was £21billion in 1994. That'd be much higher now due to inflation etc.

The chunnel is 32 mile long and was "simply" a straight tunnel without any need to do anything than drill straight and meet in the middle. Phase 1 of HS2 is 126ish miles and has to negotiate varied landscapes, terrain and current infrastructure (roads, other rail lines, water, established areas etc. etc.). If you use the original cost of the channel tunnel and multiplied it by 4 (distance of HS2=4*Chunnel), you're not really that far off the projected £106Billion cost of HS2.

Remember, I'm not defending HS2 or stating that it's a worthwhile investment - just playing Devil's Advocate - it's still a fuckload of money that could be better used elsewhere, methinks.
Posted : Tuesday, 11 February 2020, 21:56
Pakz
I hope they wil make it easy to use for everyone. Here it was in the news that a lot of people are not able to use public transportation becourse the ticket machines and other things like getting the right trains is so difficult to understand. 1 in 6 people have low a iq(<85) and are just not able to understand how to get by in society. These people get fined or labeled a fraud when they make mistakes.
Posted : Wednesday, 12 February 2020, 01:40
TKS
The UK needs better rail infrastructure. That's a given. It's just sad to see all these people being relocated after living in their homes for years and years. The next town up from us is having some bits and bobs demolished, so it'll be interesting to see what happens there.
Posted : Wednesday, 12 February 2020, 02:06
Jayenkai
Of course, by the time it's actually done, we'll all have hovercars and teleporters, so.. not sure what the point is, at all, really.

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